Faris Aranki: 0:00

If you want to achieve anything, you need a great idea, the best idea. You need to take others on the journey. That's where the EQ comes in, and you need to be super focused around whatever your objective is, otherwise you're not going to be successful.

‍Anshika Arora: 0:15

Today, we're talking all about the importance of emotional intelligence for business leaders. We discuss the basic differences between your intelligence quotient, emotional quotient and focus quotient, as well as how important it is to be adaptable and have a particularly high emotional quotient when dealing with your stakeholders. We're honoured to have Faris on the podcast, who is the founder of Shiageto Consulting, which specifically helps to strengthen and sharpen business strategies through his IQ, EQ and FQ formula. He's worked with a vast range of startups and global enterprises, namely the likes of Amazon, Mars, Heineken, NHS and many, many more.

Anshika Arora: 0:52

I'm Anshika. I'm the founder of Eternity, a collaborative event management startup for weddings, and I'm so excited to be hosting the BAE Lab podcast today, which is powered by HSBC Innovation Banking. Let's get into it. Thank you so much, Faris, for joining us today. I'm so excited to be talking to you on today's episode of the BAE Lab podcast, where we're going to be discussing all things emotional intelligence for business leaders. So let's just get straight into it. So, to start off in very layman terms, can you explain what IQ, EQ and FQ stand for and how they're different from one another?

Faris Aranki: 1:29

Yeah, wow, you throw me right in there, Anshika, because people are like what the hell are all these Qs? What Anshika is referring to is an equation that I use with my clients, my customers, my friends and people to say, look, if you want to achieve anything in life, you need three key components. One is IQ, and that broadly stands for intelligence quotient, but I'll explain a bit more. The EQ stands for emotional quotient and the FQ stands for focus quotient. But really putting that in layman's terms is, if you want to achieve anything, you need a great idea, the best idea. You need to take others on the journey. That's where the EQ comes in and you need to be super focused around whatever your objective is, otherwise you're not going to hit your. You know, you're not going to be successful. So IQ, EQ, FQ.

Anshika Arora: 2:09

I love that and I find that in the startup world and a lot of sessions that most founders who'll be listening attend, there's a lot of focus on the IQ and the FQ and that EQ sometimes gets missed out. I think it's great now to see EQ and community and the benefits of that side coming through, but I'd love to hear a bit more on you on. Can you share some examples of how emotional intelligence can actually positively impact and influence decision making in startup growth?

Faris Aranki: 2:37

Oh, I mean 100%, and I'm a massive proponent of EQ. In fact, I've used it to build my own business to where it is. But let's take classic examples. So I work with a lot of startups and where the EQ is necessary in a room is to really sense how is the other person feeling when I'm proposing an idea or suggestion, because I've seen very high IQ people or very strong people go buttheads and never take a step backwards. I always say if two people are pushing, you're never going to achieve, and what EQ teaches you, or should be in your head, is, if that person's pushing, maybe I should pull. Right, and then we can go in a direction. So it's that ability to read a room and go hang on a minute.

Faris Aranki: 3:16

What's going on here, right, are we? You know what's happening in terms of emotions here, and it's not just about who's got the best idea, because, let's face it, ideas there's loads of great ideas and ideas like opinions, and you know you can have two competing views on exactly the same thing. So bring a bit of EQ into a room. Yeah, and you know you asked me for a specific example I'm currently working with a coffee tech company, right? Yeah, there is such a thing.

Faris Aranki: 3:43

Right, they create tech where the founder is very high IQ, he has brilliant ideas, but he does not like talking to his team, right? So what he does is he just he just tries to pushes out the ideas through email to them and, of course, they've all got, they've all got an opinion, but he doesn't really think to sort of consult them, talk to them. Really. Really, you know, sense that there is valid, validity to what they've said and that's. That's just a big gap in EQ. So, you know, we've gone in there and helped him sort of address that and it's been like night and day in terms of not only how the team worked together but actually how quickly they're now growing.

Anshika Arora: 4:22

Well, actually that was going to be my secondary question, because when it comes to EQ, like you said, the big thing is about managing stakeholders right, whether it be your investors or your employees or your board, and how do you balance that really? So, whether it be something, I don't know, like a stage of negotiations, I guess a lot of founders are always negotiating, whether that be equity or whether that be speaking on investor terms or employee terms. Where do you think EQ really fits in and what's maybe your one top tip for every founder to look at themselves and think, ok, maybe I can try doing this differently and really increase my EQ?

Faris Aranki: 4:55

Well, I mean, it depends on what stage of founder you are. Right. If, in early days, the number one thing I'd say to all founders and the first stakeholder you should use EQ on is yourself, okay, what are your emotions telling you? And often we ignore those and I think if you haven't discovered it as a founder now, your emotions will be 50% of the success of your business, your business, right? So if you're in a terrible mood or you shout at people, you're not going to have effective meetings. But when it comes to having multiple stakeholders, okay, yes, you can do some stakeholder mapping and that's more of an IQ kind of task, which is list all your stakeholders.

Faris Aranki: 5:27

But the real EQ and the real skill that great founders do, who have high EQ, is the ability to flex okay. Is the ability to communicate the same thing in at least four different ways? Right, depending on the person in front of them, the stakeholders. It's knowing that stakeholder said you know what I'm about to meet with, and she can. She loves a logical kind of conversation, right. But then I'm about to meet a person B and they love a really emotional kind of conversation, but we're still talking about the same topic. As a great leader, I should have the EQ to even if someone I knew that I meet is get a sense from them pretty early on. Is the way I'm talking to them resonating? Is it actually, or are they looking confused? Are they beginning to be bored? Are they beginning to get angry? And if I encounter not a positive outcome or not the outcome I want, can I then change? Uh, without you know getting angry at the person or making them change?

Anshika Arora: 6:21

That's super interesting and I guess where you've said that, particularly around it starts from the founder or the individual to look within themselves. What advice would you say? How does someone do that? Because someone could be listening to this and say, oh Faris, that sounds amazing, that, okay, I need to adapt essentially exactly how I'm speaking to my various stakeholders. But what if you haven't done that exercise to intrinsically understand where you're more naturally inclined? So I may be naturally super friendly and realize, okay, I need to become more formal, or I may naturally, like this coffee tech founder, be a bit more formal and need to humanize myself. How are some of the best ways that a founder can start looking within?

Faris Aranki: 6:58

So step number one if you don't know, gather two, three friends around you and ask them right, say, how do I normally approach conversations, what do you normally see me do in those conversations, and be prepared to get, like some, some honest feedback, right, maybe film yourself in a conversation as well and kind of play it back and see all the things and the clues will be there. And if you don't know the different styles of conversation, you know you can. You can look that up. But fundamentally there there are format styles of conversation. So look for the clues.

Faris Aranki: 7:28

Am I, am I, you know? Am I coming up with lots of logic? Then I'm a very logical person, right? Am I? Do I like to tell a story, you know? Then I'm a very sort of inspiring person. Am I all about the relationship? Then I'm a very connecting kind of person. Or am I just someone who just talks at people? Then I'm a directive person, right? So try and understand. And with each of those there's plus, strengths and minuses, let's be honest. So also get your friends to explain this strong, you know, we love the logic you use, but you can sometimes just get belligerent with logic and and if somebody you know, so, so get that from your friends. So that's the first step. That's why I say have EQ with yourself, because if you don't know that right, you're going to be in a bad place of when you go into a conversation with someone who needs a different style, because you're completely unaware that there's a mismatch.

Amardeep Parmar: 8:10

We hope you're enjoying the episode so far.

Amardeep Parmar: 8:12

We just want to give a quick shout out to our headline partners, HSBC Innovation Banking. One of the biggest challenges for so many startups is finding the right bank to support them, because you might start off and try to use a traditional bank, but they don't understand what you're doing. You're just talking to an AI assistant or you're talking to somebody who doesn't really understand what it is you've been trying to do. HSBC have got the team they've built out over years to make sure they understand what you're doing. They've got the deep sector expertise and they can help connect you with the right people to make your dreams come true. So if you want to learn more, check out hsbcinnovationbanking. com.

Anshika Arora: 8:47

In your experience and for founders listening out there, what are some of the most common sides of low EQ that you've witnessed that maybe a founder should be a little bit cautious of?

Faris Aranki: 8:58

I think I mean immediate. Well, first of all, there's a lack of self-awareness. But an immediate indicator for any anybody in a conversation, not just the founders, is how much listening versus how much talking you're doing. Ok, and again, if you don't know the great thing about tech nowadays, you know we're using Riverside, but you could be using Teams, you could be using Zoom. They give you the data afterwards so you can literally see your percentage of I spoke versus they spoke.

Faris Aranki: 9:23

Right, yeah, look, look for other things, and this is why I say recording and playing back. I often do this with leaders. Look for how many times you both nod in agreement versus how many times there's a disagreement. If there's lots of disagreement, there's a clue there that you haven't got EQ because you're not looking to reduce those numbers. Now some conversations actually will have a disagreement. So it's not a hard and fast rule, but look for these clues. And then there's much more sophisticated. So the sort of stuff I look in a room is body language. How are those people? Are they mirroring each other? Are they summarizing, reflecting back? But just to the basics work out how much you're speaking versus the other person speaking, work out how much the meeting was positive versus how much was negative. Those are two good starting points.

Faris Aranki: 10:06

If you want data, you know, again we're going back to an IQ world. Give me data, show me the thing, but that's again that's. You know I'm a bit tongue in cheek, but IQ and EQ and FQ are linked. You can't have one in a vacuum. So if you're going to try and improve your EQ, right, you've got to give it focus. It doesn't just happen by accident, right, and you will get frustrated and that will impact, Right. So each of these things. But yeah, there's some. There's some top tips for founders.

Anshika Arora: 10:32

I really love that and I guess where you've spoken about EQ, iq and FQ, they, they all do go hand in hand. Where do you, well, what kind of advice would you give a founder who's maybe having a conversation and what's most natural to them as their EQ? So maybe of those four categories you said, I'm a very logical person and that could be what I bring to a conversation. And, if I can see that mismatch, what advice would you give to founders stepping outside of their comfort zone because I guess that's what EQ is about when it is around adapting. But where you've maybe grown up, say for, for example, in a corporate environment, and then you're entering the tech space or the startup space, which is stereotypically known to be a little bit more informal, how do you adapt that without maybe feeling imposter syndrome or out of place?

Faris Aranki: 11:20

Yeah, and you, I mean, you've touched on a really good point. Right, great founders and great leaders need to flex to fill whatever the team is missing. Right, particularly when you're a founder. So you need each of those four styles because sometimes the team will need the logic or the customer will need the logic. Sometimes the team just need telling right, do this, do that. Right. Other teams they need you. Times they need you to be their best friend, put an arm around them. Right, so you need it.

Faris Aranki: 11:44

Now, how is the best place? Right is I? I tell people you'll have a natural start. So one of those will be your natural. You're really good at it, but you know what it's like going to the gym and only ever doing leg stay, right. You need to work on legs, arms, shoulders, because someday you that's where the flexing is you've got to do an arms thing, you've got to reach out, and you realize you've never worked out on your arms, so they're really weak. So what a founder should be doing, or what any individual and what we work with people, is let's start practice doing reps on those weak muscles.

Faris Aranki: 12:14

So I often intentionally tell people we're going to now, do you're going to do the rest of this conversation in that style that you're really rubbish at right right, so it doesn't matter, even if even if we're having a logical debate, I need you to do it just in a telling style, in a directing style. The reason I'm doing it is to get you to build up that skill, because someday you will need that and you don't want to be using it for the first time in a high pressure situation, like a big sale to a client or you're having a difficult conversation with a key employee. So get three reps in. Practice with your friends. Change your style, do it in the mirror. You rehearse. This is what I tell people to do and it sounds bonkers. Why should I do this in my free time? Because you'll be really grateful when you get into that difficult conversation.

Anshika Arora: 12:56

Yeah, absolutely, and it's a really interesting point.

Anshika Arora: 12:58

You raise there around what's maybe your per se weak point in your skill set, right when it comes to your EQ, and I guess we're always told as founders oh you should hire someone who's better at doing something than you, so your first hire, for example, if you're not naturally inclined to do sales, that should be your first hire. Does that really come into place when you're looking at EQ? So, if you have a certain style, should you maybe build out your team or your founding team, perhaps with different levels of EQ? How important do you think that is, or does it even play a role?

Faris Aranki: 13:28

No, it is super important, right?

Faris Aranki: 13:29

There's two things here.

Faris Aranki: 13:31

One is you want a broad cross-section of skills, because, although you might be able to flex, right, certainly until you're a super flexer, every time you move to a different style is going to drain more of your own internal battery.

Faris Aranki: 13:44

So why not have someone who is a natural in that gap so that you don't always have to deplete your battery, right? So when you have a big enough team, surround yourself, so you have got people who are comfortable, their dominant style is each of those is what I recommend, but just similar to the modern world where you go and get a service that you don't know anything about. Let's take when you go and take your car in, for if you have a car, right, if you don't know anything at all about cars, the mechanic will you know, will go free reign with you, right? So, so, so if you have a minimum knowledge of cars, at least you'll know when they're talking to you. You get that, and it's the same with an electrician or something. So that is the other reason why, yes, you might still use experts, but you having a bit of background ability in each of those skills is really beneficial so that you don't overly rely and get maybe too led down the path by the expert.

Anshika Arora: 14:36

I love that and I think it's really interesting and I love that you put it in place of a mechanic and an engineer and I think a lot of founders I speak to, for example, they'll hopefully resonate as if you're a non-technical founder building a technical business, and there's some that I've spoken to in recent weeks where you do feel a bit like, OK, I need a base level of knowledge because otherwise this will just go away with the wind and yeah. So that's really interesting. I guess what are some of maybe the practices or habits that founders can start to implement to improve their EQ over time separate to the get your friends in a room, but maybe is there anything that we can do introspectively. Um, I guess you have mentioned recording yourself, but is there anything else you could advise, maybe?

Faris Aranki: 15:20

Yeah, I think sitting above all those things is put yourself out there, right, have more conversations that you find slightly challenging to force you to try new things. Okay, because going back to where the greatest strength of EQ is is managing your own emotions. And it's like I tell a lot of leaders have micro failures in your world today, so that when there are macro failures later on you'll be much more resilient. So that is one other thing that I would encourage everyone for their EQ building up.

Faris Aranki: 15:50

You know, and it can be the smallest things, you know, I'm the kind of idiot that does a monthly challenge for myself so that I can intentionally fail. Right, so I can intentionally put myself under emotional stress, but in a safe environment. And what I'm talking about is, you know, I'll say, this month I'm just going to, I'm right-handed, I'm going to brush my teeth using my left hand, no matter how frustrating that is right. This month I am not. I'm going to, I'm not allowed to take that particular bus, no matter how frustrating it is right. Just stupid rules or challenges just to build up my sort of EQ you know, emotional management side.

Anshika Arora: 16:25

I think for any founders listening out there, this is definitely a task that we should set all of them because it's so easy that your to-do list starts to grow and it's everything which is business related, and very rarely do you work on yourself, and I think now there's a lot more around personal branding and how we appear on social media or LinkedIn. But you're right, sometimes you need to take care of all of the noise, leave that behind, pause on the business, pause on the social side and actually, like you said, just look intrinsically right.

Faris Aranki: 16:51

Yeah, it all begins and ends with you as a founder, as someone in a startup, so why not invest in that and have fun? Set up a set up a watch go out group with your friends who are all doing silly challenges and compare notes.

Anshika Arora: 17:05

Yeah right for any founders listening out there. Absolutely we, we challenge you to do that this one there we go and include me.

Faris Aranki: 17:14

I'm more than happy to have a go.

Anshika Arora: 17:15

Definitely.

Anshika Arora: 17:16

Maybe we'll set that as a LinkedIn challenge soon as well, but thank you so much, Faris. It's been an absolute pleasure having you and talking. All things emotional intelligence, especially around building a startup. Before we round off, I'm sure you've heard we have three quickfire questions that we do at the end of every Bailout podcast. To start off, who are three Asians in Britain that are doing incredible pieces of work that you'd like to shout out on the podcast?

Faris Aranki: 17:42

I mean there's so many and I love that you put the limiters, because initially I was thinking globally and then I was like eight I mean I said this to Amar before and the team, Asian could be so broad. Uh, you know, I'm from the middle east so I can naturally include a whole bunch of arrows, but I dismiss them and I'm just going to go with the, with a classic agent. So three people I'd love to give a shout out to, apart from Amar, who does great stuff, but he gets enough smoke blowing up his proverbial. I'm going to call out a gentleman called Abhishek Sachdev. Abhishek not only is sort of champions people in the consumer finance place, but he's also a local counsellor, which is one of the most thankless tasks I've ever heard of, as well as being a very devout Hindu who manages to balance everything.

Faris Aranki: 18:25

And then a good friend of mine, Roxanne D'Souza, who's doing great stuff, one of the first female partners in one of the consulting firms that I have as a client, but real role model for all kinds of women and British Asians in that business and in the clients. And then the third one, another lady, Divya Malhotra Malloy, who is building a fantastic nut business, but she's just such a joyful and lovely person. So go and check out her nuts and go and say hello to her. But those are three fantastic British Asians that I have the pleasure of calling a friend but also admiring from afar.

Anshika Arora: 19:01

Amazing. We'll be sure to check them out. And how can people find out more about you and your company?

Faris Aranki: 19:06

Well, if they're interested, find out about me. Come and check out my company, which is called Shiageto. I'm sure we'll put the spelling on that. That's the Japanese word for a sharpening stone. shiageto. com is our website. If they want to talk to me, come and find me on LinkedIn. There's only one, Faris Aranki. I've already checked that. I spend far too much time on LinkedIn, but I do reply to absolutely every message and I post every day, so come and drop me a line there and we'll carry on the conversation.

Anshika Arora: 19:28

Amazing and as and when they drop you a line, is there anything that they can do, or our audience can do, to help you out?

Faris Aranki: 19:34

Yeah, set me some challenges, Come and say hello. I just love conversations. That's how I grow personally. So, yeah, nothing more you know demanding than that. Come and say hello and share your story with me and we'll take it from there.

Anshika Arora: 19:51

Amazing, any final words from you?

Faris Aranki: 19:53

Go forth and develop your EQ, be you know, get frustrated. You'll appreciate it in the long run.

Amardeep Parmar: 19:59

Thank you for watching.

Amardeep Parmar: 20:02

Don't forget to subscribe. See you next time.

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